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Discontinued forum:
Posted by Mikaia (mbmonitor) on May 12, 2008 08:46

This forum is no longer available for viewing from the public. You will be the only one to see it since you have the appropriate URL.

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Thank you.

Mikaia
http://wnd.com

I NEED TO BE CONVINCED OF MR. WARREN'S HERESY
Posted by orangutan on May 12, 2008 05:10

Now, how in the world do you suppose the teachings of Rick Warren contradict or “heretical” to the above scriptural verses from the Bible???

Many have told me that those who complaint about Rick being an apostate or a heretic are themselves heretic and apostates. What a turnaround I might say!!

Notwithstanding though...., as one who doesn't really know much about the "in-thing" today about Rick the "heretic"(??), can you please provide me with a slug for my shotgun so that I can go back to my colleagues in the Baptist church and tell them straight to their faces that: "Now look...., here's an answer that shall shut up your "lions' mouths""

Thank you.

Mike

Disgrace
Posted by joy316 on Mar 31, 2008 22:47

Mr. Warren, I think that you have done a tremendous disservice to the Gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ by mixing it with secular humanist philosophy. One of your congregants, Rupport Murdoch perverts the American culture with the most vile and sinful programs. Your Fox News Network shamelessly distorts the truth (Fox News is the source for the infamous Rev. Wright sermon on 9/11), constantly shows scantily clad women in the background of its stories, and produces the shameful “Moment of Truth” where people brag about horrible deeds for money. How could this horrible unrepentant man be a member in good standing in any true church? How could you pastor such a church where such disgraceful behavior is condoned?

RE: MAYBE i
Posted by on Mar 28, 2008 14:28

Because Rick Warren, unfortunately, is a VERY popular individual within what is left of modern American Christianity. He is a zillion-selling author, and countless churches have modeled themselves after his designs. He, probably more than anyone else, has popularized the "seeker friendly church" in America. Do whatever it takes to "get the young people in church". Of course, this means hand waving, lighter lifting pop music, and the gospel of "God loves you just as you are"...and that's pretty much it.

Reply to: bob
Why is Rick Warren even a factor or a person of intrest. Is there some reason that I should care what he thinks.
I have never heard of him except on WND.

Purpose Driven Lie
Posted by ChristianZionist on Mar 23, 2008 11:43

Rick Warren is an apostate. I am surprised how this sub-standard book "Purpose Driven Life" became the best seller.

Bigger Isn't Better
Posted by spaceman on Mar 20, 2008 22:40

I guess Jesus wouldn't make it as a modern day Pastor.
Even though He was often surrounded by crowds,
Jesus would abandon them in order to avoid being forced into being made a King. Jesus wasn't interested in popularity; He was on a mission to do the Will of the Father.
Unlike Pastors of today who set their sights on increasing memberships, even if it means compromising what is written in the Word of God, Jesus never strayed away from the scriptures. He confronted hypocrisy head on and challenged anyone to prove Him wrong with the scriptues. In other words, Jesus came to Earth to save sinners and not to create a growing religious club by popularity.
The dream of every virgin Pastor is to have a large congregation and a giant Church building because these are signs of success. I wonder how Pastors of mega churches respond to John 6:66 that says, "At this point, many of His disciples turned away and deserted Him."
Amazing? Jesus turned to the twelve and asked if they were going to abandon Him also. Think about it. Just a short time earlier, Jesus was surrounded by over 5,000 men, women, and children and all this happened in one day! Can you imagine the headlines in the newspaper of a church that increases its membership by over 5,000 in one day! AMEN! Then, it all changes because people begin to go away.How would you like to be the pastor who explains to other mega pastors how or why he lost thousands of memebrs?
It is common for modern day Pastors to glorify God for increasing members and it is normal to blame Satan when people leave. Was Satan at fault in John chapter 6? I don't think so!
Jesus knew what was inside the heart of every man which is why He wouldn't allow the rich young ruler to follow Him unless he sold everything he owned and gave the money to the poor. The man loved Money more than God and was guilty of coveteousness. He was the exact opposite of the discription our Lord in Philippians 2:1-11. If the man truly obeyed the Greatest Commadment to love God and his neighbor as he should, he would've humbly obeyed our Lord!
If I understand the chronology of Jesus' feeding the 5,000, it happened after King Harold murdered John the Baptist and our Lord had originally withdrawn Himself to a secluded area where He could spend time alone with the Father in prayer. Unfortunately, because He was very popular, Jesus had His own type of Paparatzi who spread word of His location and people started coming from everywhere just to be healed by Him. It grieves my heart to imagine that no one seemed to care about His own feelings regarding the loss of a loved one because all they could think of was their own needs. Then again, Matthew 20:28 tells us the Son of Man did not come into the world to be ministered to but to minister to others and to give His life as a ransom for many.
The disciples acted like typical human beings by telling Jesus to send the crowd away but Jesus had compassion. Unfortunately, Christians of today have the same attitude as the disciples because we close our hearts to eachother and send those in need of loving fellowship away! Sometimes, we allow ourselves to be deceived by people who aren't really in need or we are confronted by heartless people who either take advantage of our generosity or act violently toward us.
People are eager to attend Church as if it is a sacred Law but once church service is over, there goes their obligation to God! Many of these same people live the same way that unbelievers do and yet they are back to Church on Sunday like GOOD CHRISTIANS. Of course, we all hear the same old story, "Don't judge others." I wonder what Jesus would say about that. Have they ever read the Bible other than a yearly Bible plan? Could Jesus' words to hypocrits about washing the inside of the cup applies to Christians as well as the Jews of His day? Please read Matthew 22:23-27. I Can't help but wonder if seriously Jesus would rebuke them and call many, "children of the devil." Read John 8:31-59.
In John 6, Jesus strongly confronted the crowds who had been looking for Him on the other side of the water. Without holding any thing back, he told them they did not belive in Him, but their only interest in Him was the bread and fish. They then challenged Him by demanding He should performm a miracle. I guess feeding over 5,000 people wasn't a miracle in their eyes.
Jesus wasn't a modern day miracle worker who performs signs
to prove the presense of God. I doubt He performed in tents or put on side shows. He wasn't there for shows like you see on religious broadcasting. Jesus healed when it was time to heal but He didn't go around hitting people in the head or putting on a performance like dancing around on stage or passing out undr some spiritual influence! Jesus was not a performer and neither were the Apostles! I challenge any modern day healer to show me in scripture that things were done the same way back then as they are now! I don't know about you, but I believe the WORD OF GOD and I choose the WORD OF GOD over modern methods every day! I have been accused of being too Biblical and my greatest critics claim my problem is I never go away from this Book, the HOLY BIBLE.
Jesus knew what was inside the hearts of men and he challenged them. He didn't come to increase in numbers but to call sinners to repentence. In fact, the gate to destruction/ hell is wide and many go that way while the gate to salvation/ heaven is narrow and few go that way.
It is true that the Church in the first few chapters of Acts multiplies and God added 3,000 souls but they were different than the Church of today. They worshipped and fellowshipped with eachother daily. They weren't selfish with their belongings except for the two who lied to the HOly Spirit because they probably also loved money. Believers studied the scriptures, they listened to sound doctrine, they rejoiced in persecution and they, refused to compromise.
If Jesus were to visit our Mega Churches, what would be His attitude? Would He knock over the money changer's table and call it a den of thieves? Would He accuse the decons and elders of adultery? Would He rebuke the Churches for not teaching against the deeds of the Flesh (Romans 1 and Galatians 5), especially aganst sexual sins such as fornication, adultery, lust, and homosexuality? What if the Apostles were to visit? How many false teachers would become blind? How many people would die? ed Jesus doesn't have to physically appear because God is already there in the person of the Holy Spirit.
Oh, yes, modern day Church members want all the conviences of mega Churches but are they willing to lose it all for the cross? If Jesus demanded the richest members to sell all they owned and give the money to poor people (not the church or some organization), would they obey? If Islamic terrorsists or government soldiers invaded the buildings and vowed to murder anyone who refused to denounce Christ, how many of these 1,000s of faithful members would pray to Jesus, thank Him for their salvation, and confess Him as LORD while losing their lives for His name's sake? Read Matthew 10.
Regardless of what church we go to or what size it is, the life we live for Jesus is our greatest testimony. If God's Word has truly taken root in our heart, People notice its fruit. Anyone can claim to know Jesus but only those who keep His commandments are they who truly love Him (John 14:15, 23-25 and 15:1-17). The best way we can ever demonstrate our love for Him is by our willingness to lose our lives for Him and the Gospel just like the three Hebrews who refused to worship the golden image or like Daniel who continued to pray to the LORD GOD even though it meant being throne into a den of lions (3:8-30 and Daniel 6). We have one advantage that these four men didn't have and that is, we are on this side of the cross for our Savior is risen which means death has been conquored! Please read Romans 10:8&9; John chapter 20; and 1 Corinthians 15.
I never argue about the second coming of Christ because Jesus made it clear that He shall return when the Father wills for Him to do so and He shall come as a "thief in the night." I just want to be ready by always being prepared.
Whenever I hear people talk about their Mansion in Heaven, I like to say, "My Mansion is lying prostarted before the throne of God while worshipping the LORD in total Spirit and Truth."

Don't know much 'bout super
Posted by traitorbill on Mar 16, 2008 18:02

churches, but that would be a great sermon anywhere outside islam.

Reply to: spaceman
Pastor Warren,

We live in a time when bigger is better and richer is grander; especially in religion. Ask any modern day Pastor what are common sings of a successful church and he'll tell you:
1. Growing Congreagation
2. Large Building
3. Talented, Educated, and Gifted Ministers
4. Popularity
5. Large amount of Finances

Ask any Pastor what you need to do to be saved and he'll tell you something like this:
1. Admit you are a sinner
2. Feel sorry for your sins
3. Accept that Jesus died for you
4. Pray and ask him to come into your heart

Mega Churches like yours have been popping up every where, especially when they have popular music performed by gifted performers. Sermons are always exactlay what people want to hear and churches grow so much that you end up having several sermons on Sunday. People seem to be so filled with the Spirit that you would think Christ's Kingdom is already here on Earth. But is it?
What happens to these same people after they leave the congregation? Do they take the Holy Spirit home with them? You'd be amazed at how Church members act differently inside the building than they do outside in the real world; however, even inside the building, their behavior changes once the service is over. While the music is going, everyone sings in harmony and claps their hands in unity but once the service is over, people aren't always very friendly. In fact, sometimes, they can be down right rude!
What about the other six days of the week? You'd be surprised at how many Church Members live like those who don't even believe there is a God. Either they are living in immorality or they are extremely mean. Many people have no problem donating money to build bigger churches while ignoring the needs of people around them.
How many Church Members study their Bibles outside the service or even take time to read them? If they did, they would live a life closer to Jesus's by demonstrating the love of God much better. They would also live obedient lives to God's will by avoiding immorality and families would be closer together. Christain voters would be more careful about who they elect to office because they would vote according to Biblical morals and family values.
How do people get saved? Do they get baptized into a certain denomination or pray a certain prayer? What happens if a person accepts Jesus by prayer and later regects Him for another religion? Suppose a person becomes a murderer, drunkard, or sex offender? What must I do to be saved?
The major problem we have in our churches today is it looks like everyone wants to be popular by growing in numbers. Seldom do ministers preach about repentence or true commitment to God. Both Jesus and John the Baptist told people to repent for the Kingdom of Heaven was at hand. Jesus told people to deny themselves, take up their cross, and follow Him. Jesus also warned people that if they didn't lose their lives for His sake and for the gospel's sake, they couldn't be saved. Jesus taught that people have to be born again by believing in Him. He told a rich young ruler to sell all he had and give the proceeds to the poor because the man loved money more than everything and only wanted to follow Christ on his own terms. Please read Matthew 3:1-10; Matthew 4:17; Matthew 16:24-27; John 3:1-18 and 36; and Luke 18:18-27.
What must I do to be saved? This question was asked by the Philippian jailer in Acts 16:29-34 and he was told to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. Believing in Jesus is not like accepting that He is real or calling Him the Son of God. The demons believe God is real and they know that Jesus is the Son of God. Believing in Jesus Christ means you surrender to Him as your Lord and your only purpose in life is to follow Him through self denial and obedience to God's Will. Please read Luke 10:25-37; Philippians 2:1-11; James 2:1-19; Romans 10:8:9; and Ephesians 2:8-10.
How do I live a live for Christ? By living according to the guidance of the Holy Spirit and not surrendering to temptation. Galatians chapter 5; 1 Corinthians 10:13; Romans 1:16-32; 1 Corinthians 5:1-11; 1 Corinthians 6:15-20; and 1 Timothy 1:8-17. We grow in faith by learning God's Word, the Bible. Romans 10:17 and Psalm 119:11.
Pastor Warren, I seriously, yet humbly believe that all Mega Churches, especially yours, need to get back to God's Word and concentrate on people living obediently to His will. Our Lord Jesus wasn't very popular when it came to preaching the Gospel because everyone left Him except for the twelve after He started teaching about Himself being "the True Bread of Heaven." Read John 6:22-70.
The gate to destruction is wide and the majority of the human race shall end up passing through it (Matthew 7:13-14) but God wants us to share the Gospel anyway because He loves all sinners and isn't willing that anyone should persih (2 Peter 3:9) but all come to repentence. If we truly love Jesus and our fellow man (Human being), then we would share God's Word without compromise and help fulfil the Lord's Prayer (Matthew 6:10).
God loved everyone even when no one loved Him and gave His Son as a payment for our sins (1 John 4:10-19). Shouldn't we share His love with others by shining our light and being God's ambassadors while on Earth? Read Matthew 5:14-16 and 2 Corinthians 5:11-21. We are also soldiers of God's kingdom and we fight against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places and we must wear the armour of God at all times which is found in Ephesians 6:10-19.
How do people know we are real Christians and not just religious? The answer is found in a favorite song I heard for the first time 31 years ago. The words went like this:
"AND THEY'LL KNOW WE ARE CHRISTIANS BY OUR LOVE, BY OUR LOVE.
YES THEY'LL KNOW WE ARE CHRISTIANS BY OUR LOVE."
Jesus commanded His disciples to love eachother the same way He loved them and He declared that people would know they were His disciples by the way they demonstrated their love for one another. Read John 13:1-16; John 14:15-27; and 1 Corinthians 13. This same command applies to us today.

You Must Be Born Again
Posted by Dale on Mar 13, 2008 09:09

Pastor Warren is leading many to a bright new world. By bringing savvy marketing techniques to the Church he has helped create the Seeker Sensitive church model, greatly enlarging membership rolls. The problem is, he and other "Evangelicals" have accomplished this by making church more palatable to sinners. Removing the mention of icky topics like sin, hell and blood atonement makes filling seats much easier, but leaves many lost in their sins.

A god of Love is preached, while THE God of Love, Justice and absolute Holiness is ignored. Sermons preaching the Word of God from the Holy Bible have been replaced by self help psychology with a Bible verse or two sprinkled in when it helps the message. How to balance my family budget or be a better lover won't get my sins forgiven.

Now that Pastor Warren has "fixed" the Church, he seems to have embarked on a campaign to broaden the Ecumenical movement to include everyone on the planet, regardless of in whom they place their faith. Working with such "Godly" institutions as the U.N., he seems to believe bridges of peace can be built and utopia can be achieved through human kindness and good will. Sounds good, but it is only serving to water down the Glorious Gospel of THE Lord Jesus Christ and replace it with a New World Order religion. "Unless the LORD builds the house, they labor in vain that build it."

Born again followers of Christ should surely be doing a better job of good works in the world, but the Gospel must be preeminent, for what does it profit a man to gain the whole world, yet lose his own soul? The world needs the Prince of Peace, period.

You can find the True Gospel here: http://www.livingwaters.com/good/

What Must I Do To Be Saved?
Posted by spaceman on Mar 07, 2008 20:25

Pastor Warren,

We live in a time when bigger is better and richer is grander; especially in religion. Ask any modern day Pastor what are common sings of a successful church and he'll tell you:
1. Growing Congreagation
2. Large Building
3. Talented, Educated, and Gifted Ministers
4. Popularity
5. Large amount of Finances

Ask any Pastor what you need to do to be saved and he'll tell you something like this:
1. Admit you are a sinner
2. Feel sorry for your sins
3. Accept that Jesus died for you
4. Pray and ask him to come into your heart

Mega Churches like yours have been popping up every where, especially when they have popular music performed by gifted performers. Sermons are always exactlay what people want to hear and churches grow so much that you end up having several sermons on Sunday. People seem to be so filled with the Spirit that you would think Christ's Kingdom is already here on Earth. But is it?
What happens to these same people after they leave the congregation? Do they take the Holy Spirit home with them? You'd be amazed at how Church members act differently inside the building than they do outside in the real world; however, even inside the building, their behavior changes once the service is over. While the music is going, everyone sings in harmony and claps their hands in unity but once the service is over, people aren't always very friendly. In fact, sometimes, they can be down right rude!
What about the other six days of the week? You'd be surprised at how many Church Members live like those who don't even believe there is a God. Either they are living in immorality or they are extremely mean. Many people have no problem donating money to build bigger churches while ignoring the needs of people around them.
How many Church Members study their Bibles outside the service or even take time to read them? If they did, they would live a life closer to Jesus's by demonstrating the love of God much better. They would also live obedient lives to God's will by avoiding immorality and families would be closer together. Christain voters would be more careful about who they elect to office because they would vote according to Biblical morals and family values.
How do people get saved? Do they get baptized into a certain denomination or pray a certain prayer? What happens if a person accepts Jesus by prayer and later regects Him for another religion? Suppose a person becomes a murderer, drunkard, or sex offender? What must I do to be saved?
The major problem we have in our churches today is it looks like everyone wants to be popular by growing in numbers. Seldom do ministers preach about repentence or true commitment to God. Both Jesus and John the Baptist told people to repent for the Kingdom of Heaven was at hand. Jesus told people to deny themselves, take up their cross, and follow Him. Jesus also warned people that if they didn't lose their lives for His sake and for the gospel's sake, they couldn't be saved. Jesus taught that people have to be born again by believing in Him. He told a rich young ruler to sell all he had and give the proceeds to the poor because the man loved money more than everything and only wanted to follow Christ on his own terms. Please read Matthew 3:1-10; Matthew 4:17; Matthew 16:24-27; John 3:1-18 and 36; and Luke 18:18-27.
What must I do to be saved? This question was asked by the Philippian jailer in Acts 16:29-34 and he was told to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. Believing in Jesus is not like accepting that He is real or calling Him the Son of God. The demons believe God is real and they know that Jesus is the Son of God. Believing in Jesus Christ means you surrender to Him as your Lord and your only purpose in life is to follow Him through self denial and obedience to God's Will. Please read Luke 10:25-37; Philippians 2:1-11; James 2:1-19; Romans 10:8:9; and Ephesians 2:8-10.
How do I live a live for Christ? By living according to the guidance of the Holy Spirit and not surrendering to temptation. Galatians chapter 5; 1 Corinthians 10:13; Romans 1:16-32; 1 Corinthians 5:1-11; 1 Corinthians 6:15-20; and 1 Timothy 1:8-17. We grow in faith by learning God's Word, the Bible. Romans 10:17 and Psalm 119:11.
Pastor Warren, I seriously, yet humbly believe that all Mega Churches, especially yours, need to get back to God's Word and concentrate on people living obediently to His will. Our Lord Jesus wasn't very popular when it came to preaching the Gospel because everyone left Him except for the twelve after He started teaching about Himself being "the True Bread of Heaven." Read John 6:22-70.
The gate to destruction is wide and the majority of the human race shall end up passing through it (Matthew 7:13-14) but God wants us to share the Gospel anyway because He loves all sinners and isn't willing that anyone should persih (2 Peter 3:9) but all come to repentence. If we truly love Jesus and our fellow man (Human being), then we would share God's Word without compromise and help fulfil the Lord's Prayer (Matthew 6:10).
God loved everyone even when no one loved Him and gave His Son as a payment for our sins (1 John 4:10-19). Shouldn't we share His love with others by shining our light and being God's ambassadors while on Earth? Read Matthew 5:14-16 and 2 Corinthians 5:11-21. We are also soldiers of God's kingdom and we fight against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places and we must wear the armour of God at all times which is found in Ephesians 6:10-19.
How do people know we are real Christians and not just religious? The answer is found in a favorite song I heard for the first time 31 years ago. The words went like this:
"AND THEY'LL KNOW WE ARE CHRISTIANS BY OUR LOVE, BY OUR LOVE.
YES THEY'LL KNOW WE ARE CHRISTIANS BY OUR LOVE."
Jesus commanded His disciples to love eachother the same way He loved them and He declared that people would know they were His disciples by the way they demonstrated their love for one another. Read John 13:1-16; John 14:15-27; and 1 Corinthians 13. This same command applies to us today.

RE: MAYBE i
Posted by rob on Feb 28, 2008 22:23

Well, simply as any one who walks in truth are very concerned with other peoples salvation, eternal life.
Here are some good links, simple and some easy listening to. Skip some verses below.

Matthew 13:18Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower.

19When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.

20But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;

21Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.

22He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.

23But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

24Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field:

25But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.

26But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also.

27So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares?

28He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up?

29But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them.

30Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

36Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field.

37He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;

38The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;

39The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.

40As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.

This is why you should be concerned. The word says plainly those who practice the false heresy become like tares that have a well defined future to be burned and I do not like it at all what he is doing!

With 25 + million books sold, the err has been spread like a crop duster full of weed seeds.


reinventingjesuschrist.com (a simple fast read ebook)

http://cicministry.org/radio_series.php?series=redefining

(paste link in address bar)-it is a good audio series well done with respect.


Luke 11:35 Take heed therefore that the light which is in thee be not darkness.

Reply to: bob
Why is Rick Warren even a factor or a person of intrest. Is there some reason that I should care what he thinks.
I have never heard of him except on WND.